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	<title>Comments on: How business is done on the Internet</title>
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	<link>http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/</link>
	<description>Blog of a thinker, writer and smart-arse</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 00:42:58 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Christy Dena</title>
		<link>http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81748</link>
		<dc:creator>Christy Dena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 02:54:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81748</guid>
		<description>Hey Elias. Thanks for taking the time to reply to my comments. 

I think what I would appreciate in your model then is an indication of the income sources. There is a big difference between the consumer being a source of income, an advertiser being a source of income and then some other business that you drove business too (Four Eyed Monsters example), and even a company that buys demographic information. Each of these have some effect on the consumer experience, the infrastructure of the service or product, and are implemented according to different strategic needs. 

As you noted, perhaps change the 'fee' value to fixed, variable and user-defined or volunteered or something like that. Each one of these are strategies for specific outcomes.

Also, why not say 'content' instead of 'hypermedia'? Content has more semantic stability and is more accessible, I think, than hypermedia which (in new media arts and theory) refers to a specific type of media and artform.

Hope this helps! Your post has inspired me to mock up my own business model guide on the cross-media entertainment industry specifically. Thanks Elias. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Elias. Thanks for taking the time to reply to my comments. </p>
<p>I think what I would appreciate in your model then is an indication of the income sources. There is a big difference between the consumer being a source of income, an advertiser being a source of income and then some other business that you drove business too (Four Eyed Monsters example), and even a company that buys demographic information. Each of these have some effect on the consumer experience, the infrastructure of the service or product, and are implemented according to different strategic needs. </p>
<p>As you noted, perhaps change the &#8216;fee&#8217; value to fixed, variable and user-defined or volunteered or something like that. Each one of these are strategies for specific outcomes.</p>
<p>Also, why not say &#8216;content&#8217; instead of &#8216;hypermedia&#8217;? Content has more semantic stability and is more accessible, I think, than hypermedia which (in new media arts and theory) refers to a specific type of media and artform.</p>
<p>Hope this helps! Your post has inspired me to mock up my own business model guide on the cross-media entertainment industry specifically. Thanks Elias. <img src='http://Liako.Biz/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Charlie</title>
		<link>http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81745</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Apr 2008 02:28:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81745</guid>
		<description>A lot of sites I use appear to be just loss leaders. For example, although most Google products have some advertising component the main aim seems to be to get you to use Google search. Twitter would make a great loss leader for a large company looking to build an internet presence (News Corp perhaps). The service itself doesn't need to be income generating as long as it provides cross-over users for other income generating services.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A lot of sites I use appear to be just loss leaders. For example, although most Google products have some advertising component the main aim seems to be to get you to use Google search. Twitter would make a great loss leader for a large company looking to build an internet presence (News Corp perhaps). The service itself doesn&#8217;t need to be income generating as long as it provides cross-over users for other income generating services.</p>
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		<title>By: Nicola</title>
		<link>http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81687</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicola</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Apr 2008 16:10:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81687</guid>
		<description>Hi, Harold Jarche is also collating &lt;a href="http://www.jarche.com/?p=1524" rel="nofollow"&gt; thoughts &lt;/a&gt; about open source business models at the moment - revenue being an issue as you describe above - seems similar to the web2 companies in terms of startup. How to turn from developer community, perhaps with initial investor like Mark Shutterworth did with Ubuntu, which seems a bit similar to story with founders of  &lt;a href="http://www.pbs.org/mediashift/2007/05/digging_deepertwitter_founders.html" rel="nofollow"&gt; Twitter &lt;/a&gt;.

I think it gets more complex with the mobile web because of revenue possibilities or challenges with advertising - not many people right now want to receive adverts via SMS, or whilst they are browsing and they are less likely to click on them if they are using their mobile to browse - because they have less time, but &lt;a href="http://www.admob.com/s/home/?_cd=1" rel="nofollow"&gt;Admobs &lt;/a&gt; seems to show that this is changing slowly&lt;a href="http://www.funambol.com/about/" rel="nofollow"&gt; Funambol &lt;/a&gt; seem to fit with your 'platform' definition with their open source mobile application server ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Harold Jarche is also collating <a href="http://www.jarche.com/?p=1524" rel="nofollow"> thoughts </a> about open source business models at the moment - revenue being an issue as you describe above - seems similar to the web2 companies in terms of startup. How to turn from developer community, perhaps with initial investor like Mark Shutterworth did with Ubuntu, which seems a bit similar to story with founders of <a href="http://www.pbs.org/mediashift/2007/05/digging_deepertwitter_founders.html" rel="nofollow"> Twitter </a>.</p>
<p>I think it gets more complex with the mobile web because of revenue possibilities or challenges with advertising - not many people right now want to receive adverts via SMS, or whilst they are browsing and they are less likely to click on them if they are using their mobile to browse - because they have less time, but <a href="http://www.admob.com/s/home/?_cd=1" rel="nofollow">Admobs </a> seems to show that this is changing slowly<a href="http://www.funambol.com/about/" rel="nofollow"> Funambol </a> seem to fit with your &#8216;platform&#8217; definition with their open source mobile application server ?</p>
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		<title>By: Elias Bizannes</title>
		<link>http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81654</link>
		<dc:creator>Elias Bizannes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Apr 2008 07:22:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81654</guid>
		<description>@Janette: this isn't being presented anywhere. It is academic, but if people agree on the matrix, I would be more than happy to share practical examples. I blog to learn, and your comments are appreciated

@Christy: Good observations. With your first comment I think this is just marketing - the interactive experience is hypermedia as a product, as content is essentially offering people an experience. What makes this hypermedia product different in the way you describe, is what the 'return' is which I think you make a good point about short term and long term. So the "revennue model" when the return is branding, is that it's a long term component of attention (short term attention is a instant sale), where the user agrees to give their time by paying attenion in return for the experience. It might be better to label "revenue model" as "return on product" as this is essentially what it is. But this doesn't detract from the point, the "return" the company gets is "attention" from the user.

Arguably however, the actual transction occuring is between the company and the intermediary creating the game and so it's a business to business transaction which falls outside the scope of the above matrix. The above matrix only applies when there is a direct interaction with the consumer, which technically occurs with the intermediary offering the gaming experience (and therefore, their revenue model is a fee for developing it).

Your other comment about people offering donations at any amount is actually something worth adding to the revenue model mix. Although perhaps we could expand the definition of 'fees' from being a "fixed amount" to a "one off amount" (and therefore is dinstiguished from a subscription which is a recurring amount; which can also be a donation but not fixed)? 

Four Eyed Monsters is an interesting one. Again, it's clear the product is hypermedia; where the confusion is is the revenue model. I think this goes back to the uniquness of the content industries in they way they are intermediaries. I think in this case, the revenue model is commission. The reason I say this, is because the revenue of the company is conditional on it meeting a hurdle - that being, user acquisition. This is similar to commisions on a transaction, where you make a percentage depending on the amount of cash raised.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Janette: this isn&#8217;t being presented anywhere. It is academic, but if people agree on the matrix, I would be more than happy to share practical examples. I blog to learn, and your comments are appreciated</p>
<p>@Christy: Good observations. With your first comment I think this is just marketing - the interactive experience is hypermedia as a product, as content is essentially offering people an experience. What makes this hypermedia product different in the way you describe, is what the &#8216;return&#8217; is which I think you make a good point about short term and long term. So the &#8220;revennue model&#8221; when the return is branding, is that it&#8217;s a long term component of attention (short term attention is a instant sale), where the user agrees to give their time by paying attenion in return for the experience. It might be better to label &#8220;revenue model&#8221; as &#8220;return on product&#8221; as this is essentially what it is. But this doesn&#8217;t detract from the point, the &#8220;return&#8221; the company gets is &#8220;attention&#8221; from the user.</p>
<p>Arguably however, the actual transction occuring is between the company and the intermediary creating the game and so it&#8217;s a business to business transaction which falls outside the scope of the above matrix. The above matrix only applies when there is a direct interaction with the consumer, which technically occurs with the intermediary offering the gaming experience (and therefore, their revenue model is a fee for developing it).</p>
<p>Your other comment about people offering donations at any amount is actually something worth adding to the revenue model mix. Although perhaps we could expand the definition of &#8216;fees&#8217; from being a &#8220;fixed amount&#8221; to a &#8220;one off amount&#8221; (and therefore is dinstiguished from a subscription which is a recurring amount; which can also be a donation but not fixed)? </p>
<p>Four Eyed Monsters is an interesting one. Again, it&#8217;s clear the product is hypermedia; where the confusion is is the revenue model. I think this goes back to the uniquness of the content industries in they way they are intermediaries. I think in this case, the revenue model is commission. The reason I say this, is because the revenue of the company is conditional on it meeting a hurdle - that being, user acquisition. This is similar to commisions on a transaction, where you make a percentage depending on the amount of cash raised.</p>
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		<title>By: Christy Dena</title>
		<link>http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81630</link>
		<dc:creator>Christy Dena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Apr 2008 04:48:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81630</guid>
		<description>Oh, and what about projects where the content is offered for free but consumers/audiences are encouraged to join another community who then gives a percentage in cash to the original content creators? EG: Four Eyed Monsters did this with Sprout and OnStage (http://foureyedmonsters.com/). Or, people volunteering the amount they give for a product (eg: RadioHead &#38; Nine Inch Nails offering their songs for free, but you could nominate how much you want to pay)?...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, and what about projects where the content is offered for free but consumers/audiences are encouraged to join another community who then gives a percentage in cash to the original content creators? EG: Four Eyed Monsters did this with Sprout and OnStage (http://foureyedmonsters.com/). Or, people volunteering the amount they give for a product (eg: RadioHead &amp; Nine Inch Nails offering their songs for free, but you could nominate how much you want to pay)?&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Christy Dena</title>
		<link>http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81627</link>
		<dc:creator>Christy Dena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Apr 2008 04:24:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81627</guid>
		<description>Hey Elias. Good post. I appreciate the way you have divided up different viewpoints on business. I'm wondering where branded entertainment fits. For example, cross-media games that are commissioned by a company to raise brand awareness (and at times to advertise a product too). The player does not pay and does not have to go and buy the product either. On the one hand it can be seen as advertising but there are also projects that are not aiming to sell a particular product, instead they want players to associate a certain experience with a brand. Long-term versus short-term gain. Just a quick thought after reading your post quickly!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Elias. Good post. I appreciate the way you have divided up different viewpoints on business. I&#8217;m wondering where branded entertainment fits. For example, cross-media games that are commissioned by a company to raise brand awareness (and at times to advertise a product too). The player does not pay and does not have to go and buy the product either. On the one hand it can be seen as advertising but there are also projects that are not aiming to sell a particular product, instead they want players to associate a certain experience with a brand. Long-term versus short-term gain. Just a quick thought after reading your post quickly!</p>
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		<title>By: Janette Toral</title>
		<link>http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81619</link>
		<dc:creator>Janette Toral</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Apr 2008 03:58:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://Liako.Biz/2008/04/how-business-is-done-on-the-internet/#comment-81619</guid>
		<description>I like the way you analyzed it. For the presentation, I think a pyramid can best represent it. My only worry though is the academic-sound of the piece.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like the way you analyzed it. For the presentation, I think a pyramid can best represent it. My only worry though is the academic-sound of the piece.</p>
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